Translating Your Admin Skills with Ashley Sisti

Today on the Salesforce Admins Podcast, we sit down with Ashley Sisti, Sr. Manager of Business Strategy and Operations at Salesforce.

Join us as we talk about translating your admin skills, career progression, and having honest conversations with your manager about your skillset.

You should subscribe for the full episode, but here are a few takeaways from our conversation with Ashley Sisti.

An admin origin story

Like a lot of folks we have on the pod, Ashley started out as a Salesforce Admin. What began as customizing leads ended up as an opportunity to learn everything she could, and enabled her to make a career pivot into a position at a company that was migrating to Salesforce. She learned a ton about implementation and building things from scratch.

Later on, Ashley worked with a larger Salesforce team as a business analyst, where she got to put her work in context with a developer, project manager, and be an expert in specific parts of the business. Now at Salesforce, she works in business operations, working on systems, technology, and processes that support our customer-facing teams. Essentially, she works on how Salesforce uses Salesforce.

Why admin skills are transferable

“Learning to be a Salesforce Admin is also really transferable to a lot of other parts of working in a business,” Ashley says, “it’s a really good way to learn about business and how businesses operate in a less scary way.” You’re solving problems, but you’re having a lot of conversations that are really about business transformation.

Half your job is asking questions to get to the why behind what they want you to do, and that can help you learn a lot. This translates directly to something like the five whys — a common tool business analysts use to get to the root causes of a problem and figure out how to fix them. I’ve linked a past podcast we did about this below.

Having hard conversations with your manager

One thing that happened as Ashley grew her career is she started to encounter problems that couldn’t be solved just by tweaking something in Salesforce. Sometimes you need more people, or more budget, or a broader scope. “You have to start thinking about how does the company, overall, solve this problem and not just how do I go in and execute on it,” she says, “but when you get comfortable with thinking on things on a larger scale you can really start to grow your career.”

You also need to be able to talk honestly with your manager about your skill limitations. “A good manager will be happy when you come to them because they can help you identify how you can grow those skills,” Ashley says. But how do you know they’ll be supportive? Ashley runs through what to look for, and how to make the tough decisions to grow your career.

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Links

• Kevin Richardson on Getting to the Why

Social

• Salesforce Admins: @SalesforceAdmns 
• Gillian: @GillianKBruce
• Mike: @MikeGerholdt

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Full transcription

Mike Gerholdt: Welcome to the Salesforce Admins Podcast, where we talk about product, community, and career to help you become an awesome admin. Now, this week we’re talking with Ashley Sisti, who is the Sr. Manager of Business Strategy and Operations at Salesforce. For a little different twist, we’re talking about admin skills, translating your admin skills, career progression, and having an honest conversation with your manager about skillset. In the U.S., it’s heading into the winter. It’s becoming kind of that later part of the year. And I don’t know about you, but I love podcasts where I can just kind of sit down, chill out and listen to some people have a really interesting conversation. And I love to get Ashley’s perspective on talking with our managers, talking with our users. We have this fun conversation about talking with our direct managers about where Salesforce is going and what we’re trying to do with our roles. Sit down, put your feet up. If you have a fire, maybe start that and sit back and let’s get Ashley on the podcast. So Ashley, welcome to the podcast.

Ashley Sisti: Thanks for having me.

Mike Gerholdt: Now, this is your first time on, I would love to know and kind of get acquainted to how you got to Salesforce and got into the admin community.

Ashley Sisti: Yeah, absolutely. So my admin journey started at a very small company where I was kind of wearing a lot of hats. I was working on the website and doing some marketing and basically anything that involved a computer. And we used Salesforce primarily at the time for lead generation and doing some cold calling. And so I was asked to sort of figure out some ways that we could customize leads to what we were doing. And that kind of set me down the path of learning more about how I could configure Salesforce to work for us. And so we started adding a lot of different functionality at that company. So I did that for several years and kind of used that as an opportunity to teach myself how to be an admin, as I know a lot of people have. And then I was able to leverage that experience into a physician at a company that was just in the middle of implementing Salesforce as a migration from a legacy system.

And so then from there, I kind of got to learn what goes into doing an implementation for the first time, what to do, what not to do. And then really got to build a lot of things from scratch and learn a lot about that business. And then a couple years after that, I joined a team as a business analyst that was a larger Salesforce team. So I learned to work with the developer and with the project manager and to kind of get to dive a lot deeper into certain parts of the business where I got to be an expert. And then eventually that kind of opened me up to an opportunity here at Salesforce on a strategy and operations team. And so I’ve been here for about three and a half years, primarily working in business operations. So working on systems, technology, and process that support some of our customer facing teams. So really how we use Salesforce internally at Salesforce is kind of what I’m doing now.

Mike Gerholdt: Salesforce on Salesforce.

Ashley Sisti: Exactly.

Mike Gerholdt: Everybody loves those stories.

Ashley Sisti: Yeah.

Mike Gerholdt: Now, as you were talking, I was just looking back because I know we’ve done a few podcasts. One of them sticks out in my head of Ciara Skiles that talked about translating different skill sets from different universes and different roles that she’d been in. And boy, if I had a nickel from every time I’ve talked to an admin that said, “My career got started because I knew things on the internet. I do computers.” You mentioned kind of starting there in business process. One of the things that I wanted to talk about and you’d brought up as something very passionate for you is kind of how does admins showcase and really discuss their varying different experiences and translate that across from… I think you and I both discussed on a previous call about working in retail and how awesome that can be over the holidays.

Ashley Sisti: I think about it every time this time of year.

Mike Gerholdt: Yes. And I think about it because I was pre Cyber Monday, I believe, as they call it. So I was old school retail where they did doorbusters at 4:00 AM because, I mean, who doesn’t want a fleece blanket for $3 at 4:00 AM?

Ashley Sisti: Yeah. I think what’s really interesting to me is not only are there a lot of sort of skills that you learn from other jobs that are really transferable into becoming an admin, but learning to be a Salesforce admin is also really transferable to a lot of other parts of working in a business. And I think it’s a really good way to learn about business and how business operates in sort of a less scary way, right? So in the beginning, you’re sort of just solving problems and understanding how to configure a system to kind of meet the specifications that the business is asking for, but it really helps you get into the door of a lot of conversations that tend to be about business transformation at some point. And I think as you start to build trust with the business, you become this person who… Especially at a company where you are the only admin or there are only a couple of you, you’re in those conversations about how to transform your business with technology because Salesforce is going to be a key way of how that business does that.

I didn’t know anything, obviously, when I graduated from college about how companies operate. And obviously, I learned a lot at a really small company, but then at a bigger company I really got to learn about how individual departments worked because I was in there asking tons and tons of questions, right? As I’m sure every admin knows, you feel like half your job is just asking people questions about what they do and trying to get to the why behind it. And it’s such a good way to learn about how business works. How individual teams work, how they work together, what’s important to the company.

And so I’ve just been really grateful that I have this experience as an admin, that kind of helped me translate into a position that wasn’t just about Salesforce admin anymore. When I joined Salesforce I wasn’t an admin. We have a whole business technology team that does that work, but I was sort of a process owner and had to understand how people used Salesforce to match their process. And I would never have guessed that what, six, seven years before that, that that’s something I would’ve ever been able to do because I didn’t know anything about how companies worked in the beginning.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. I feel like it’s an enviable position because I look back at my time as an admin and… I mean, it’s a bit arrogant to say, but I think I was one of very few people in the organization that knew end to end what the customer experienced.

Ashley Sisti: Absolutely. Yeah.

Mike Gerholdt: Because everybody’s in their own marketings, in their own silo. We had service, we had a sales department, and I would even carve out executives because they’re kind of in their own ethos of running the business. Right? Which is its own animal. And each person that I talked to knew to the grain of salt what it was like. For example, when contracts was done with something and they handed off to the service department, because the place I was at service actually did the implementation of stuff. I had zero idea, right? They could tell you the person, they could tell you the cubicle, they could tell you the cubicle number, the inner office transfer number that they send the contract to. Couldn’t tell you what that person does. Might know them at a holiday party, couldn’t tell you what they do, right? And I feel like as an admin, A, you’re in those discussions.

I think you bring up a point that makes me think, there was departments that I had to sit down and work with that I knew for certain I would never work in this department. Right? My skills aren’t transferable over here. Well, it takes a little bit, but the legal department, just sitting down and working through documenting how our sales people, if they were to interact with a government official and how we have to document that and consistently cross the board. And it’s just like, can’t we just with this all in a sticky note somewhere and just go? Can’t this be easier? But you learn to appreciate their attention to detail and their patience and their thoughtfulness of every step along the way and the impact it has on the business. You want to talk about making your head spin. You have a meeting with legal in the morning and then you go meet with sales in the afternoon. And you will sleep like a baby that night because you’ll just be mentally and emotionally tired.

Ashley Sisti: Yeah. You can’t see me over here nodding my head vigorously the whole time you’re talking, but I had that same experience where it’s like this person and this office is who this goes to, but I couldn’t tell you what they do with it once they get it. It was funny, you talked about this sounds a little arrogant. One of the things I loved about being an admin at a small size company was you were the expert. People knew that you were the person to go to when they didn’t know, well, what happens when I hand this off to so and so? I’ve never really thought about it because I haven’t had to. But now that I’m using a system where instead of walking over to them and handing it to them, I’m actually inputting it somewhere. I can see what happens when they get it, right?

It opens up departments to help them connect better because now they’re all operating out of one place where they can all kind of see what each other is doing. I found that being that person that initially had to kind of connect the two sides and understand how they fit together and put that in a system, also then allowed those different departments to start talking to each other and understand better kind of how their work affected one another, because they could see it all, which was just so fun. I thought it was great to have them be like, “Oh, I can see the contracts team did this after I input this invoice.” And you’re like, “Yes, I did that. I let you see that.” It was so fun. That’s one of the things I loved about being an admin.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. So one of the other topics that we really wanted to kind of hit on was in addition to just how do we translate that experience, I think exposure is one that we brought up. I’d be curious, so before we move on, as an admin, you’re working through with these different departments. You do choose to make a career shift. That happens. You have a lot of career choices. What would be the things or how would you highlight that to a perspective department? We’ll keep it easy because we’ll just stay within the same company. How’s that sound?

Ashley Sisti: Yeah. I think that there are some really transferable skills that you develop as an admin that are relevant everywhere that if you have them, you’re an asset regardless of whether you have domain expertise and whatever the thing is that you would be doing. One of those is problem solving. I was talking earlier about asking questions, and that’s a lot of it. But I think really trying to understand the why behind something and understand… We do this business process improvement thing here at Salesforce. And one of the things we talk about is the five whys, which I’m sure a lot of listeners have heard before, which is really getting to understand not just the symptom, but the cause. What’s the thing that’s really happening that’s kind of resulting in what we’re seeing, which any part of any business that wants to improve how they operate, it’s valuable to them.

And so I think that problem solving and understand the why is one thing. Another thing, I think, is the business acumen that you learn from being an admin. You learn about the priorities that are important to the company based on where they’re willing to invest in technology and process improvement, right? So I think a lot of companies, their main use of CRM is often sales because obviously what’s important for the company is to bring in revenue, but you kind of learn how companies make decisions about what’s important and what’s not important. And you also understand what metrics are important because often as an admin, you’re making sure that when you build a solution that it’s reportable and that it’s something whose performance can be measured. And that’s another kind of thing that I know I was really sort of blind to when I started out as an admin, is understanding what KPIs are important to businesses and how they measure things.

As an admin you really learn about a lot of that, and then you can bring that knowledge into whatever the other part of the business that you’re going into is. But I think regardless, someone who can understand a problem, diagram a process from beginning to end and say like, “These are the places where I see opportunities for improvement or innovation.” That’s what’s valuable. Honestly, that’s how I got my job at Salesforce, was the fact that I was able to do that completely agnostic of developing a solution in Salesforce. It was more about being able to look at an overall process and bring those skills to the table.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. And you had me thinking, I had to look up. So we actually did a podcast with Kevin Richardson a while back on the five whys.

Ashley Sisti: Nice. Awesome.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. We did it a couple times. I’ll link the most recent one, but he talks about the Washington monument and how it got bird poop and stuff on it. And they were talking about cleaning it and why does it get this and why does it get that? And that’s always stuck in my head of the five whys, because I feel one thing that my team does really well is we show you the very cool, shiny feature. And we sometimes forget now you have to articulate why the organization’s going to use this, and then how you’re going to report on it.

Ashley Sisti: Yeah, absolutely. It’s funny you have the Washington monument story that sticks for you because the story that sticks for me in this business process and improvement training thing that I went through, the example was something way more close to home, which was like in your house, there are kids’ toys everywhere. Right? And sort of, why are there kids’ toys everywhere and how do we fix it? The first level down was, well, the kids are leaving their toys everywhere. They need to learn to put them away. But then as you got further of further down, it was like, oh, there actually isn’t a place that’s easy for them to get to, to put them away. And like, well, why is that? Well, because X, Y, Z. You kind of got down to this root cause that was not about the fact that kids weren’t putting their toys away. It was much more about, well, how do we design this overall system in our house to better support the process, which is kids playing. So it’s funny, I think. The way you learn that, it always sort of sticks with you.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. And the one thing that I learned going through the five why stuff, and it’s really just as simple as asking why five times, is to not… especially if you’re doing it where you’re the one trying to problem solve, right? If you actually were the parent at home is to like, okay, I’m going to do this five why because I listen to the podcast and my kids got toys everywhere. And I think the fallacy that people fall into or the pitfall is they try in the second or third why to give a salient answer that actually doesn’t get to the core problem, right?

Ashley Sisti: Yeah, that’s a good point.

Mike Gerholdt: Well, why do you have kids’ toys everywhere? Well, because they don’t have a place to put it away. Well, why is that? Well, I never got around to getting to Target. Why is that? Because I’m so busy at work. And you’re like, “Okay, I got to the core reason.”

Ashley Sisti: How do I fix that?

Mike Gerholdt: How do I fix that? And you’re like, “No, you were actually just asking the why and solving for as far as you wanted to investigate.”

Ashley Sisti: Yeah. That’s a really good point.

Mike Gerholdt: So the other thing that you wanted to touch on and we talked about earlier and I agree with too, in addition to kind of switching where you’re at in an organization, having that overall organizational view is also moving up. Career progression.

Ashley Sisti: Yeah.

Mike Gerholdt: Boy, there’s a whole bunch of… And you even brought it up too. KPIs, performance metrics. If you are a single admin in an organization, you could be inventing your career ladder. And how do you progress up that? How do you show career progression? What are some of your thoughts on that?

Ashley Sisti: Yeah, it’s super interesting because I think it’s so different depending on the kind of the company and where they’re willing to invest. That’s actually sort of what prompted my move from kind of being a solo admin to moving to a company where I was on a team, is because I didn’t see that career progression. I was sort of coming and saying, “There are a lot of cool, innovative things we can do, but I can’t maintain a hundred person org every day and do all these new innovative things. We need to grow this team.” And I didn’t see that there was really a lot of interest in doing that. And so I felt like, okay, well, I’m going to have to make a huge change if I want to stay here and grow my career because I can’t just be… I’m never going to get out of this maintenance mode of this org that I created.

And so I think in that case I felt like, okay, well, I need to go find a place where there’s a real investment in a CRM in this case. A CRM team where there’s a lot of opportunity for growth. And so that’s what I did. But I think within an individual company, one of the things that can be kind of scary and that was sort of scary for me is when you feel like you are an admin expert, you kind of know anytime someone comes to you with a problem, you think in your head, I know exactly how I would solve that in Salesforce. I know exactly what objects and what flow I would create to kind of solve that problem. I think it’s a little scary when you start to have problems that are bigger than just things you can solve in a system, right?

You have to start thinking about people and you have to start thinking about budget and scope and things that are more about like, how does the company overall solve this problem? Not just how do I go in and execute on it? But I think that’s really how you start to grow your career, is you start to get comfortable with thinking about things at a larger scale and knowing that you’re not necessarily going to be in there day to day executing, but you’re going to be making more strategic decisions about how the company is going to solve problems, whether they use technology or not. And I think you can go a couple directions. You can go in the… I want to kind of own the entire sort of CRM team at my company. And then maybe I want to take that even higher and say I want to own systems.

And then you kind of take that path, or there’s sort of, I think, a more technology agnostic path that’s more about kind of a lot of the roles that I’ve ended up in here at Salesforce, which is strategy and operations. It’s more about how do we do this? Not just like, how do we do this in a system? So I think depending on what interests you, you can kind of take either path. I’ve honestly struggled a little bit with really liking to be down in the weeds, but knowing that being down in the weeds isn’t how you grow your leadership skills and how you eventually manage people and kind of grow that side of your career. So you sort of have to be willing to give up some things, I think, to grow your career in other ways, which can be hard and a little scary at first.

Mike Gerholdt: So I want to touch on the scary part. And I mean this honestly, because I was thinking back, we probably haven’t talked about this on the podcast. Have you ever had to have an honest discussion with your direct supervisor about your skill limitations?

Ashley Sisti: Yeah, I think so. I think I’ve had to do that a lot of times. Yeah, it’s-

Mike Gerholdt: How’d that go?

Ashley Sisti: I’m a perfectionist and I don’t like to do something unless I’m really good at it. So it’s a really hard thing for me to admit and a difficult conversation to have. I think when you have a manager that is supportive and wants to grow your skills, they’re happy, almost, for you to come to them and say, “This is where I feel like there’s a gap.” Because then a good manager can help you identify how you grow those skills. And I think I’m in a place with my manager now where I’m lucky enough to have that. My team was sort of reorganized recently and our focus has shifted, and I 100% sometimes feel myself in a place where I don’t have a lot of expertise. And I know those core skills, like I said, that I can fall back on like problem solving, but sometimes the more tactile concrete things that I need to be doing every day are not things that I’m super familiar with.

And what I’ve found is knowing what you’re comfortable with and knowing where you need help and asking for really specific help seems to be really valuable. Because if you sort of just say, “Well, I don’t know how to do this.” No one can help you. But if you can say, “Here’s what I am understand about what’s happening and here’s where I feel like I can add value, but here’s where I’m not sure what to do next.” I think having a transparent conversation like that is really important because, like I said, I think a good manager will help identify, okay, well, here’s how I would get this started. Why don’t you go try this and then we’ll talk about it and we’ll talk about how it went? So that you’re not out there on your own trying to do it outside of your skill set. And you have to be willing to do that anytime you’re trying to go your career, because obviously you’re not going to be an expert in every single thing that you go to do, especially as you add more responsibility.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. I want to press you further on this. How did you know you could be comfortable with your manager bringing that up? Because I’ve been in that position a few times prior to becoming… in my current role, but when I was an admin at an organization where there was just, no, I just shook my head and nodded and left the meeting and processed my anxiety attack quietly in a break room with overpriced Coke Zero and some pretzels that were probably put in there sometime in the 1970s, because I don’t think break room vending machines are ever updated.

But I also had the flip side where I did feel comfortable telling my manager, telling my direct supervisor at the time where I ran all of Salesforce. Hey, if you want to have this done, you got to hire a consultant or we got to get a developer on the team. And I can give you the vision. I can tell you what needs to be done, but I don’t have the skill to write the code. And I think there’s people listening to this podcast right now that would love to know from you, what were the cues that you looked for that made you feel comfortable telling your manager that?

Ashley Sisti: Yeah. It’s such a good point because it can be hard to know if you’re in that position until you’re actually in it.

Mike Gerholdt: Right.

Ashley Sisti: I think one thing is… This might sound sort of counterintuitive, but a manager who gives you autonomy and trusts you to be in meetings and make decisions and doesn’t feel like they have to be there with you every step of the way, doesn’t feel like you have to run everything by them. That’s a manager who trusts you. And that means that they also trust you to know your comfort level and where your boundaries are. And if you feel like you’re in a position where my manager lets me kind of go in and make decisions on behalf of the team and I run things by him or her and we talk about them, but I don’t feel like I have to get their approval for everything I do, I think that usually means that you have a manager who trusts you.

And that trust is really what is the most foundational part of being able to have that conversation. I think if you have a manager who you feel like kind of micromanages and they kind of feel like they have to be in control, that’s someone who maybe isn’t going to handle as well you saying, “I’m not sure I can do this,” because they’re looking for someone who’s in control of every situation. They want to make sure that nothing is going to go wrong and that no one’s going to get blamed for anything. And so they don’t want to hear that you don’t know how to do something.

So I think looking for that trust is super important. And I think that’s obviously important in a lot of different places, but especially if you feel like this is a conversation you have to have. That’s a big part of it. I think also being able to… Maybe if you feel like you’re not sure if you’re in a position where you can have this conversation, maybe bringing to the table the things that you… Sort of reminding about the things that you are doing, right? The places where you are adding value and like, hey, these are all the things I’m doing. This is the gap. And we can either solve this gap by hiring someone else. Maybe I can take a course or I can do a certification or I can just spend a lot of time with people who do know how to do this if you’re willing to help me grow.

Coming with solutions and not just, I can’t do this. What do we do? But like you said, like, hey, I can provide the vision, but we need to hire a developer. You kind of have to come with that I’ve thought enough about this in the scope of what I know to know how to move forward. That’s really important because I think a manager is much more likely to support you than if you just say, “I can’t do this.” That’s much harder for someone to figure out how they should handle it.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. We did a lot of talk about managing up. I think to kind of wrap things up as we also have to be considerate that we have a bunch of users we have to communicate with and we have to imbue them with the sense of confidence that there’s somebody at the steering wheel, I’d be open to kind of your suggestions or what you’ve done in the past for experience to relay that level of confidence and that level of trust to your users.

Ashley Sisti: Yeah. That’s a good question. I think one of the things is communication. People have a lot more faith in someone who communicates transparently to them and is honest when maybe there are things that they’re still working on, but making sure that communication is there. Making sure that feedback is heard is super important. I think your users are going to have a lot more… Your users, whoever they are, right? They could be your end users of your system or when you’re outside sort of just working on Salesforce as an admin and your end users are sort of the people whose processes you’re potentially touching. Making sure that their feedback is heard and that you… Obviously, you’re not always going to act on it, but there are going to be times where the feedback is great and you’re going to go run down how you take that and how you work on it so that you’re improving their experience.

That back and forth feed back loop, I think, goes a really long way to creating trust. And being willing to say when you don’t have all the answers. I feel like I’ve heard from so many leaders in so many different webinars and advice type environments that I don’t know is an okay answer as long as you have kind of a plan for how you’re are going to attack it. And I think that same thing goes for end users, right? If they say, “We want to do this.” Or, “I want to do that,” the best answer is not always, yes, I know exactly how to do that. Often that’s not the best answer because you haven’t taken the time to really understand.

And a lot of the times it’s, I don’t know, let me go research it and think about it. Or sometimes it’s, let’s have a longer conversation so I can and really understand what it is that you’re doing, so that I can figure out the best solution for you. And people feel listened to and heard that way. And even if you don’t know right off the bat, they feel like, okay, you really understand my process and you understand what’s important to me. And I trust that you’re going to have that interest in mind when you design a solution.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. I feel like I don’t know, but I have a plan and here’s how I’m going to get the answer is completely acceptable. It’s also a very scary answer to say.

Ashley Sisti: It definitely is. I think it’s a courageous answer, though, because sometimes it’s better to say I don’t know, but I’ll figure it out than to come up with an answer on the fly that you’ve committed to something that [inaudible].

Mike Gerholdt: Right. Yeah. I once had a friend tell me they called it solutioning on the fly. And I’ve often referred to that in the context of kind of building a bridge. If you were solutioning on the fly to build a bridge to get you across a gap, I bet that bridge would look 10 times more complicated than if you just took a step back and actually planned out what the entire bridge was going to look like, so…

Ashley Sisti: Yeah, exactly.

Mike Gerholdt: Well, this is a fun discussion at, Ashley. I’m glad we got connected. You’re always welcome to come back on the podcast and share experiences or things that are top of mind with our admin community.

Ashley Sisti: Awesome. Thank you so much. This has been really fun. Man, I was in the admin community. This is near and dear to my heart. So I’m happy to come back anytime.

Mike Gerholdt: Well, I would say you’re always in the admin community.

Ashley Sisti: That’s true.

Mike Gerholdt: It’s just a matter of what else you’re doing.

Ashley Sisti: Yes, exactly. Thank you.

Mike Gerholdt: You bet. So it was a fun discussion with Ashley. I think you’ll agree it can be hard talking to your manager about where your skills end and where you need help or where you’d like to grow the organization to, or your vision for Salesforce within an organization. And she brings up a lot of salient points. One of them I heard a lot during this podcast was trust. And I still will lean back on that. We also mentioned the Kevin Richardson podcast, I think, a few times. So I’ll include that link in the show notes as well. It’s from 2016, but it’s still super salient to what we talked about. I mean, the truth in anything content-wise is it can stand the test of time. And I think absent of us maybe renaming the podcast, that one’s still very good. But anyway, that link is included.

And of course, if you want to learn more about all things Salesforce Admin, go to admin.salesforce.com to find more resources. We got new swag on the Trailhead store and the clock is ticking before… You got to get those holiday orders in, get everything for a nice office gift exchange. If you recall back, Laura in our retro show would love a Salesforce Admins Podcast mug. If you get her in a holiday gift exchange. Of course, the link to all that swag and more is in the show note. You can stay up to date with us on social. We are Salesforce Admns on Twitter, no I. And fun story about that is also on the podcast. And it’s also actually in our YouTube channel. You should watch that too. You can follow Gillian, who’s my co-host. She is @gilliankbruce. I am @mikegerholdt. And with that, stay safe, stay awesome. And stay tuned for the next episode. We’ll see you in the cloud.