Solving Business Problems with Composer and Flow with Jennifer Cole


Today on the Salesforce Admins Podcast, we talk to Jennifer Cole, Manager of the CRM & Analytics Team at 908 Devices. Join us as we chat about business processes, Jennifer’s latest presentation at Dreamforce, and why it’s so important to understand everything about a problem process before you try to implement a solution.

You should subscribe for the full episode, but here are a few takeaways from our conversation with Jennifer Cole.

Admins are problem solvers

Jennifer swapped to a smaller company in order to make bigger decisions about how the Salesforce ecosystem there would be run. She’s had the opportunity to hire her own team of #AwesomeAdmins to support that vision. “I’m glad I like hats, because I wear a lot of them,” she says, “but I think, as an admin, everything we touch is problem-solving.”

For her Dreamforce presentation, Jennifer focused on what she did when her company came to her to improve its order entry process. And while she was approached by people who wanted specific things fixed about it, she knew from experience that she needed to broaden her perspective. One technique she uses is to start from the initial request and find out whom that person is chasing and ask them the same questions about their process, the person they chase, and so on. That way, she captures the entire business process and all of the problems that need solving to make it run more smoothly.

When roadblocks aren’t actually roadblocks

One question that Mike raised on the pod is what teams should do when one business unit simply isn’t on Salesforce. “That can be a false roadblock,” Jennifer says, “I know that’s often what admins hear but I don’t see it as a dead end.”

Often, those teams are curious about how moving their process into the system can streamline everything and plug into the powerful automation and analytics tools Salesforce has to offer. The key is to convince them that you can do things to make what they’re already doing better, rather than coming from the angle that what they’re doing is wrong.

Why understanding the problem makes solving it easy

In Jennifer’s Dreamforce session, she went over how Flow and MuleSoft Composer helped her make big changes to her organization’s business processes. But how did she get there? The first step was to chart out the problem she was trying to solve in a more detailed way. “Think about the entire workflow and the elements needed for success,” Jennifer says, “and if those elements have a risk of not being there or not being complete they become a section of the problem that I have to also solve to make the whole process work.”

While it’s an important first step, understanding the problem is only part of the process of actually solving it. You need to decide what will be your source of truth for each record, even if that’s in different systems for different pieces of information. “It’s a slow process but once you have that down, identifying the tools and the way the data moves becomes the easiest part of all of this,” Jennifer says.

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Full show transcript

Mike Gerholdt: Welcome to Salesforce Admins Podcast, where we talk about product, community and career to help you become an awesome admin. This week we’re talking with Jen Cole, who is the manager of the CRM at analytics team at 908 Devices. And ooh, let me tell you, I really hope you’ve got a super awesome plan for a dog walk or you’re just starting your spin class or you’re popping in this episode just as you’re getting ready to leave for work because we are about to have the most fun.

I don’t know what this episode ends up being, 25 minutes, talking about business process, chasing down what you’re trying to accomplish, teams, issues, sections of problems, business definitions of how you’re going to use a tool and then ultimately coming to the tool and the solution that you’re going to build.

I have honestly been in the ecosystem for 15, 20 years and I had questions for Jen after this episode. This was so much fun. I really like sometimes that we dig deep into business process and problem solving because that’s what we do as admins.
So sit back, go for a walk, do what you’re going to do, you’re about to have just a fantastic rest of your day after you listen to this podcast. So with that, let’s get Jen on the podcast. So Jen, welcome to the podcast.

Jen Cole: Thanks Mike. Really looking forward to talking to you today about all the cool things I love to do with Salesforce.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. Well, I will admit that I missed your session at Dreamforce, but I did see your picture on quite a few slides, so I feel like I’m talking to a little bit of a celebrity, but CRM and analytics-

Jen Cole: Ditto.

Mike Gerholdt: What’s that?

Jen Cole: I said ditto. I’m talking back to a celebrity, so.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. I was not on any slides. That’s okay. I’ll take it. CRM and analytics team manager, manager of CRM and analytics team. We need to have a title writing class at 908 Devices. Can you tell me how you got into that position?

Jen Cole: Absolutely. I left a large organization as admin, one of many for a very global company because I wanted to do more with my problem-solving. I am a huge Salesforce fan, I have been an admin for enough to know that there’s a lot of cool stuff to play with and I was just kind of hit that sailing at my old job of what I was allowed to do versus what IT was allowed to do.

So an opportunity came up to join a smaller organization and run their ecosystem and it was a pretty scary but awesome jump at the same time and came in to run their sales force, take it over from an external consulting agency and just have in-house support to run it.

From there it was pretty cool how quick my management was excited and bought into the capabilities of the tool once they had an in-house person. And from there I’ve been growing a team of awesome admins to support me.

Mike Gerholdt: Wow.

Jen Cole: So it’s pretty fun. Yeah.

Mike Gerholdt: So you said a lot of trigger words that I’m going to ask you about because-

Jen Cole: Excellent.

Mike Gerholdt: … I get asked all the time and I think it’s a little different, but I want to hear your answer. I get asked all the time. So what does an admin do?

Jen Cole: Oh my gosh, that is such a big question.

Mike Gerholdt: Right. And that’s why I was like, I want to hear what you do because I feel like even if I pulled 100 truck drivers, “So what does a truck driver do?” I would get 100 different answers

Jen Cole: Yeah, for sure. I believe it. So maybe I’ll take a stab at summarizing my 100 different answers for you. As an admin, a lot of hats. I mean, I’m glad I like hats because I wear a lot of them. So I do a lot of training for users, user support and play in the space of actually mostly problem-solving.

I think that’s really my jam and what I love about being an admin. But as an admin, I think everything we touch is problem-solving. Whether it’s a page layout and making it ergonomic for the user to fill in everything.

Validation rules or formulas or building flows to improve processes or moving a team in that aren’t currently using the system or not using it well or even connecting systems to Salesforce. It goes back to problem-solving. So in all the ways to solve them, I think myself and my team are doing them.

Mike Gerholdt: Wow. I like that answer. We a few years ago on the admin team did a poll of the community and problem-solving was the number one answer.

Jen Cole: Oh, look at that.

Mike Gerholdt: It makes sense.

Jen Cole: That’s pretty fun.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah.

Jen Cole: Yeah. I’m in with the crowd.

Mike Gerholdt: I also feel like your air traffic control, you know?

Jen Cole: Yes. Good analogy.

Mike Gerholdt: I own this thing, it’s mine now. And you not only took it over from a consulting implementation, but to the point of ownership, which I think is proof that you can grow your career in this field is like, well, here’s everything we can do base level, but I can take us next level. Let’s do more.

Jen Cole: Yes. It’s the fun stuff.

Mike Gerholdt: You spoke about fun stuff at Dreamforce and we had a Salesforce colleague connect us to be like, “Hey, have you seen what Jen did?” And she sent me a video of kind of a little bit of snippet of your presentation. I was like, “Oh my God, that’s really cool.”

And then you and I talked and this is the cut to the chase, and I was like, when we were chatting, the one thing that we do at all of our events, and I’m guilty of this, is we’ll get up and we’ll show you this very perfect problem that so perfectly fits this solution that we’re about to show you.

And I think one thing that always, we’ve always wanted to keep the real real in what we create, especially in admin relations, is you’re not going to run into these perfect problems and then, oh, by the way, rarely is just one solution going to be that solution.

And so I would love to know as we get to the solution, what the business challenge was that kind of came at you and then how you went about thinking through so that other admins can hear and be like, understand how you put together the solution you put together?

Jen Cole: Yeah, I’m happy to share. It was not a new problem to me. I think it’s one that is seen across so many companies. My company came to me and said, we really just want to improve our order entry process. We lose time chasing down sales, getting the information into NetSuite, which is our ERP, to book the orders and move on in the process.

We’re really struggling at this one piece. And as an admin and having played at the large company, played with different teams, you know there’s more than just that ask. It’s the onion. There’s the layers beneath it that they’re not yet sharing. So while I had the original ask to really focus on the order entry team, I knew there was pain for more than just the order entry team.

That was the person who just raised their hand. And I think that is something as admins we’re really good at working with the people that raised their hands because they’re the squeaky wheels. They’re the ones that are like, “This isn’t working. This is not efficient. Can you fix it for me? This is what I need.”

But I’ve learned that there’s so many people that are experiencing pain but don’t always raise their hand. So when they came to me with this problem, intuition, experience, maybe a little bit of both, maybe the fact I just love solving problems and puzzles is, well, who else has pain but isn’t raising their hand?

So I love to go in and say, “Okay, tell me what you are trying to accomplish.” The person who’s raised their hand experiencing the pain and say, “What are you trying to accomplish? Who are you working with? Who are you chasing?” And then I go to the person they’re chasing and I say, “Okay, who are you working with? What’s your pain in this situation? Who are you also passing information off to?”

And in those interviews I get little nuggets, I get little clues that I kind of follow along, like Sherlock Holmes I guess, and figure out, geez, it’s not just the order entry team, but my sales people are really lacking process and need help.
The post-sales team who has to work with the customer once the device is sold, they’re also experiencing pain here. They’re not getting the information they need timely or all of it at once and they’re chasing down folks. What if I can actually build a solution that helps everybody?

And from there I start looking at what are all of the tools I have available to me in my system, or what do I need to get to fill gaps to actually solve that problem? So I first approach it by who’s struggling and who are the silent martyrs in the process. And then I approach the tool conversation.

Mike Gerholdt: Okay. I like where you’re at. So for the critical person saying, “Man, I wish that was my job.” Do you feel you have a ton of autonomy to go after some of those discussions? Or were those, as you said, well, the first person, the order entry team was the one that had the initial squeaky wheel and then you’re, who are you chasing? I like that term.

And then who are you chasing, right? Because I almost feel like those are next steps for you. Are there, or maybe you’ve ran into it in the past, what would your advice be for admins who are, “Well, it looks like this team is chasing this other team. I might have an issue because they don’t use Salesforce.”

Jen Cole: Oh, that’s a good question. And I like it because it actually a can be a false roadblock because I think even if a team that they’re chasing isn’t using Salesforce, doesn’t necessarily mean that their process can’t be improved to make the team who needs to consume the information for Salesforce work better or more easily.

So I still find it worthwhile to interview those teams because when I’ve done that in my current company in problem, or solving this problem rather, I have found those folks are starting to get curious. And I have this image in my head of your neighbor peering over your fence when you’re getting your house remodeled. They’re kind of like, “What’s going on over there?”

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. What are doing there? Oh, there’s another moving truck coming.

Jen Cole: What’s happening?

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah.

Jen Cole: I find when I interview those teams out of Salesforce, they’re having that curious neighbor effect. And we’re actually moving a lot of those processes that we’re traditionally out of the system into the system because they love how the data’s being handed off through automation. They love the reporting and analytics they can get.

They love that it’s becoming their 360 view of the customer, but also that the health of the pipeline too. So while I know that’s often what admins hear, I don’t see it as a dead end. I see it as a trail that hasn’t been taken care of and it’s overgrown and nobody wants to go there. Go there, get your hands dirty.

Mike Gerholdt: Good analogy. I like that term false roadblock. I think that’s a lot of those that you run into when you’re trying to chase down a process and build a technical solution for it.
A lot of roadblocks, a lot of hesitation because to some degree, and I’ve ran into this, departments feel like they have their part figured out and you’re going to mess that up.

Jen Cole: Yes. They don’t always like it, but yes.

Mike Gerholdt: So jump ahead. I like chasing through the process. Ultimately we have to build the solution. And here’s where I really want to focus kind of what we are talking about, because I feel like where you approach this isn’t just one solution. There’s a lot of times, like how do we understand how to put multiple solutions together?

And so not to bury the lead, you use MuleSoft Composer and Flow, but how did you get to MuleSoft Composer and Flow? Because in a keynote, let’s just say for example, Sally, who just miraculously ran across this problem in her organization and she’s going to just instantaneously like a light switch, no, to use MuleSoft Composer and Flow.

Jen Cole: Right, not real life. Sorry.

Mike Gerholdt: Exactly, right. So probably didn’t happen to you. What really happened to you? That sounds weird.

Jen Cole: It sounds super weird, but-

Mike Gerholdt: Four years later after Castaway, she was rescued from this deserted island, but I mean, you know-

Jen Cole: Friends with Wilson. Yeah.

Mike Gerholdt: Still friends with Wilson. Yeah, exactly. Good catch.

Jen Cole: Yeah. So how did I come to the solutions that I used and stitch them together is the question I’m hearing.

Mike Gerholdt: Yes. And thank you for clarifying the question.

Jen Cole: I got you.

Mike Gerholdt: So few people do.

Jen Cole: I found myself looking at the problem and before I could even think about the solution to it, I needed to understand the sections of my problem. And I know that sounds weird, so maybe I can break it down for you.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. What do you mean by sections of the problem?

Jen Cole: Sections of the problem. Here’s the real life, what really happened. I’m being asked to say, okay, move your Salesforce order that’s been approved, move it on over to NetSuite to book an order.

And that sounds super simple, but if you think about it, that order has products, those products have to be active and their pricing has to be set up in NetSuite and active in NetSuite to actually be passed over. I also need to identify the customer that the order belongs to, who’s paying for it, where it’s being shipped.

So these all become these sections of the problem of like, okay, I’m going to have to make sure when I pass over my product information on the order I’m grabbing the right products in NetSuite. All right. That means I’m going to have to focus on mapping products between Salesforce and NetSuite to make sure that that data’s there live.

And if a product’s not in NetSuite, I got to find a way to flag that in Salesforce. So my order entry team knows, red flag, you got to stop and fix this before you proceed and pass go and collect 200. And then for the account piece, okay, well, what do I do if that customer is not set up in NetSuite? I got to think about that situation.

So now I have an address section to my problem. Who’s paying? Where is it being shipped? What if NetSuite and Salesforce don’t match in their account modeling? Okay, I’m going to have to figure out that piece of the problem.
So even though the ask was just, “Hey, move this order over from system A to system B,” there were elements in there that also were related to that success that I was going to have to problem-solve as well.

So that’s what I mean by breaking up the sections of my problem is thinking about the entire workflow and the elements needed for success. And if those elements have a risk of not being there or not being complete, they become a section of the problem that I have to also solve to make the whole process work.

Mike Gerholdt: No, it makes sense. And I think to that, and this is probably just institutional knowledge, but you also knew, and I knew this as an admin, what platforms could or could not be replaced?

Jen Cole: Yes.

Mike Gerholdt: I hear NetSuite a lot. Some of the stuff that I’ve ran into, we had Oracle finance system. This thing isn’t going to be replaced by Salesforce.

Jen Cole: Correct.

Mike Gerholdt: You’re not going to build a total solution on Salesforce. Here are things that just along the way has to plug in. You probably kept track of that too, right?

Jen Cole: Yeah. My sources of truth, yes. And that funny little phrase we like to throw around. That was critical for me.

And I did the same thing as you’re describing, where once I understood the different sections to my problems, I had to understand which system was system of truth and make sure that was known as I flag data, move data, update records, create records, that I knew which system was going to be the winner at the end of the day for certain information.

Mike Gerholdt: So this is generally a curious question because I’ve dealt with organizations that wanted one system of truth. And I think now there’s, and I’m hearing this and you can tell me whether or not I’m crazy, but it sounds like you had multiple systems of truth, not for the entirety of a record, but for parts of records.

Jen Cole: Yeah, I did. I made it fun.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah. Well, and the reason I asked that is because as you kind of navigate through that, the goal is that you’re setting up Salesforce and it maybe the order team can look at something, but understanding as the record or maybe of multiple records or parent child records as they move through this process, fields are going to change because different systems of record are going to update them.

Did you have to navigate any of that? And if so, what would be your advice for admins as they have to work through that?

Jen Cole: Well, I definitely did. Yes, in this particular problem that the team brought to me. And I actually just kind of kept a, I’m going to say the dirty word, I kept a spreadsheet and-

Mike Gerholdt: Okay. They happen.

Jen Cole: They happen.

Mike Gerholdt: It’s as long as it’s not a system of record.

Jen Cole: It’s not a system of record.

Mike Gerholdt: See, then that’s fine.

Jen Cole: But I actually started to list out and organize all of the different sections of my problem to use that expression again and identify which system held the source of truth for that. And that actually made the next step really easy because it made it easy for me to figure out the tools in Salesforce I needed to use a Flow, Composer and how they would behave and the direction in which the data would flow under certain conditions.

So my recommendation to other admins would be don’t be afraid to write it down and iterably design the process flow. And in that process map flag or star how color code, which system is the system of truth for what information. And you’re going to make a lot of different versions of this. You’re going to go over it again and again. You’re going to present it to people that say, “Did I get it right?”

And they’re going to be like, “Nope, I forgot to tell you this.” Then you’re going to go back to the drawing board and do it all over again. It’s a slow process, but I think it’s a critical process to take time in doing because once you have that down, identifying the tools and the way the data moves becomes the easiest part of all of this. You’re just kind of executing on the design.

Mike Gerholdt: So we’ve done the process, we’ve understand the problem sections and you just led in perfectly. So you said, we’re to the easiest part, how did you identify the tools?

Jen Cole: Yeah. So I had Salesforce Flow in my toolkit to leverage, which is I’m a true Flow addict. I love it. It is amazing what that tool can do for you as an admin. But then we also had MuleSoft Composer and while the two can do a lot of similar things, I didn’t want to get caught up in, well, just because Composer is my really new cool tool, I wanted to do everything for me.

I had to be more logical about it and say, where does it make sense for this piece of the process to live? And how am I defining the usage of those tools? So one of the things I put in the presentation at Dreamforce visualizing a slide in my head right now is that I’ve defined Flow as my tool to manipulate and manage data that already lived in Salesforce.

But if I didn’t have that data, then I would turn to Composer and Composer would be my mule that would actually pick up and lift the data over to the system I needed it in, Salesforce or NetSuite, under certain conditions.

So while Composer could do probably a lot of the stuff I have Flow doing, because I defined Flow as my tool for data already living in Salesforce to be used to create records and update records downstream in the process, I left it in Flow because that was my business definition and I used Composer as my tool to move my data from system to system.

So Composer’s moving data from Salesforce to NetSuite, back to Salesforce and then Composer’s also sending information to Slack when we want to celebrate a deal, has been closed. So I’m using that as sort of my telephone operator person, which is just plugin in data.

Mike Gerholdt: There’s maybe a subset of people that listen to the podcast that won’t understand what you’re talking about because-

Jen Cole: Oh my gosh.

Mike Gerholdt: … they haven’t experienced telephone operators.

Jen Cole: I hope they Google it.

Mike Gerholdt: I could do a whole other podcast on what you just said, but you said something that I’m going to ping you on as a question because I want to know more. So you said business definition, do you write business definitions for how you’re going to use tools overall as an organization?

As an admin, do you have operating principles or do you write business definitions for tools based on maybe sprints or processes that you’re trying to fix or C, none of the above?

Jen Cole: I think it’s closer to B, that it’s really looking at the problem I’m trying to solve right now. But I would love to get to that, a higher level business definition of these are the conditions at which you should always grab Flow and these are the conditions at which you should always grab Composer.

I don’t think we’re there yet because, and it’s a hard thing to nail down day one because as an admin, you know your business is constantly in flux and changing and the things that they need will stretch and tax the system in a new way every time. So I like my definitions to be on the malleable end because there’s always going to be something new I didn’t plan for.

Mike Gerholdt: Well, and the tools are going to change.

Jen Cole: Exactly.

Mike Gerholdt: Right. I don’t know what the future of Flow is, but I promise you in two years from now, what will be a functionality that you wish you had, you might have and what you could only…
I look at what Process Builder started out as and how it ended and where Flow is and you’re just like, my wildest dreams, I wish workflows would’ve done that. Now it’s just a normal every day. It’s like, doesn’t even make Process Builder or Flow Builder sweat.

Jen Cole: Right. Yeah. Yeah, it’s true. That’s actually a very valid point is-

Mike Gerholdt: But no, I never heard of anybody writing business definitions and it was like, I don’t know, I just never heard of that approach. And it’s somebody that needs rules of the road. Okay. So if it’s data I don’t have, then MuleSoft Composer. If it’s data in Salesforce, Flow.

It’s just like, I don’t know if you like wearing the same clothes every day, you read about all those tech people that do that. But it’s one less thing to think about while you’re trying to create a solution that also gives you, well, here’s how I made these decisions.

Jen Cole: Yeah. And it also helps my team because unfortunately I can’t stick a USB stick in my brain yet and give it to them to download. So while we do a lot of documentation, it helps them to have those guidelines when they’re troubleshooting issues that users bubble up to us and say, “Hey, for some reason this order didn’t replicate. Can you help me backtrack why?”

They have an understanding when they look at the record in the error message, they can be like, “Okay, this is a moving data issue. I know I should be looking at Composer. Oh, this is processing the information received from Composer, let me go to Flow and start there first.” So having that general definition helps my team also know where to start when they’re trying to problem-solve.

Because as the systems get more sophisticated and enable us admins to do more and really be citizen developers, it makes problem-solving sometimes harder because there’s so many places you could go to look for where the issue might be hiding.
And I find that that’s helpful to be like, okay, if it’s data in the system that we’re just evaluating and manipulating to create child records related to this, head on over to Flow first. And if you can’t find in a Flow, let’s see what crazy things I did in Composer. So that helps.

Mike Gerholdt: I often forget that people work on admin teams. So I guess couple quick follow ups on that. How do you store all of that to make sure it’s common knowledge for your team in kind of operating principles?

And how do you communicate with your team so that it feels like if I were to join your team, I should know if I have a user that’s having problems and it’s data stored in Salesforce that I should look at a Flow?

Jen Cole: Good question. Yeah. It’s not a perfect system yet, but we’re getting there. But it shouldn’t be any surprise that we actually track all of our system changes and enhancements right in Salesforce. So I have a custom object in Salesforce where I just document every single change request that comes in and we link it into projects.

We have one of the cool apps from Salesforce Labs, the PMT project, to link our custom object into so we can roll it into bigger projects. Because sometimes you’re just helping solve processes, not necessarily making system changes.

And the team knows that they can go there as a resource leveraging all the cool features that we have with our Einstein Search and the native stuff in Salesforce to query and find those key words when there are issues and they can pull up the request.
Oh, Jen made a Flow for this, this is how she solved this. Oh, actually the sits in Composer. So that becomes a spot where they can actually, it’s like our own internal knowledge base of what we’ve built and we just leave breadcrumbs for each other so that they can chase them back and follow it and see where it started.

Mike Gerholdt: Right. Oh, interesting. Fascinating. I’m telling you, we could do a whole episode on business definitions and use cases and finding tools and stuff like that. So heading into next year.

Jen Cole: Yeah.

Mike Gerholdt: What is the one thing that you’re most excited about as a Salesforce admin?

Jen Cole: Oh my gosh, as an admin, it’s the new features coming out. I feel like Flow is just becoming stronger and stronger with every release and really excited about the formula stuff coming out with Flow or that’s recently come out. I think it’s really seeing Composer and Flow getting closer together.

I’m starting to see where the two systems are mirroring each other a lot and I’m excited to see what Salesforce does with that because I think there’s so much more that can be done to help admins who are overwhelmed with all of the different choices that they have out there like, when do I use Composer?

When should I use Slack? When should I do this? When is it Flow? When is it a validation rule? I think as these systems that kind of, or tools that mirror each other get closer together, it’ll really help other admins know where to go for certain solutions and how to design them.

So I’m just excited for all the automation stuff, that’s really where I am. Anything to crush a silo, Mike. I love taking down business silos because I just find them inefficient. So anything that supports that effort is a win in my book.

Mike Gerholdt: I will tell you just, I mean, anytime we do an event or anytime we put up content, automation, you mention the word automation just it crushes it. It blows numbers out.

And I think it’s, I mean, I’ll look back the way back machine 2006, I remember creating my first workflow and just the feeling it gives you of seeing somebody who has struggled with something. And at the time it was super minor, but it just flipped a record type based on the owner and it made it so that we had a contract team, made it so that they were locked out essentially because we didn’t have that as an ability to do.

And just seeing their face and they were like, “Oh my goodness, this just made my job so much easier.” And just that I think that’s why I always get excited when I see new Flow stuff and yeah, I’m sure you saw some of the stuff for Winter 23 that’s coming out. But yeah, I hear you.

Because there’s other stuff that comes out that’s like, yeah, that’s really cool and you roll it out and maybe it’s like a long burn with the user, but that automation stuff, it clicks right away.

Jen Cole: It does. And it feels so good as an admin. I hear you on that. I definitely hear you. When your sales team or your order enter team or you’re anyone who’s in your ecosystem that’s using the platform just is like, “Oh, thank you. You just gave me hours back to my day.”

And that genuine sigh of gratitude, it’s a good feeling. Like, oh, this is why I do this. This is why we sit through all those different meetings and challenge processes and work through the opinions and ideas and get to the best solution because it’s what it’s about. So I hear you.

Mike Gerholdt: Well, Jen, I appreciate you coming by and sharing your process and helping us understand sections of the problem together. This was incredibly insightful for me. This is the podcast I wish I would’ve had 14 years ago when I started as an admin. Like, oh, here’s what I need to be doing. Okay, cool. I had no idea.

Jen Cole: None of us did, don’t worry, Mike.

Mike Gerholdt: Yeah, I so appreciate that. I should be able to dig something up. We’ll do my best to include any information about your Dreamforce presentation in case people missed it. But thanks for coming by on the podcast.

Jen Cole: Thanks for having me. I had a great time talking to you and yeah, this was a ton of fun.

Mike Gerholdt: Okay. So how much fun wasn’t that, talking with Jen? Probably going to listen to this podcast three or four more times. I’m speechless. That’s how much fun it was. Just sitting around talking about things you’re trying to accomplish, going with different teams, false roadblocks. How many of those haven’t you run into?

Anyway, I hope you enjoyed this episode. I enjoyed this episode. Jen’s a rockstar on my books. If you want to learn more about all things Salesforce admin, go to to find more resources, including any of the links that we mentioned and a full transcript of the episode.

You can stay up to date with us on social. We are @SalesforceAdmns, no i on Twitter. And of course Gillian is on Twitter. She is @gilliankbruce. I’m on Twitter, I am @MikeGerholdt. And with that, stay safe, stay awesome and stay tuned for the next episode. We’ll see you in the cloud.

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